DRAFT

UNTIL

APPROVED BY SENATE

MINUTES OF MEETING OF SENATE 01 S IFiON FRASER UNIVERSITY

HELD MONDAY, SEPTEMBER 8, 1969, FACULTY LOUNGE, 7:30 P.M.

PRESENT:

ABSENT:

OPEN SESSION

Strand,

Chairman

Baird, D.

Brown, R. C.

Burstein . , K. R.

Campbell, N. J.

Caple, K. P.

Carlson, R. L.

Claridge, R. W.

Cole, R.

Freiman Mrs. L.

Fuit, B.

Hamilton, W. N.

Hean,

A.F,C.

Hut chins on, J.

Keuward, N. K.

Kirchner, C.

Korb:Ln,

Lachlan, A. H.

Lebowitz, N. A.

MacKinnon, A. R.

McDougall, A. II.

Rogow, R.

Sayre,

Srivastava, L. N.

Stratton, S.

Sullivan, U. II.

Tuck, U.

Turnbull, A. L.

Vidaver, W.

'1a1kley,

Wassermann, Mrs. S.

Evans, H. N.

Secretary

Kelsey, I.

Neakin, U.

Barboza, Miss J.

Recording Secretary

Norsworthy, Mrs. R.

Recording Secretary

Collins, N.

Drache, Mrs.

McLean, C. H.

Perry,

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S.M. 8/9/69

Mr. Caple, the Chancellor, said that it was his privilege before the

Senate meeting started to welcome Dr. Strand on his first day as President

of the University. The Chancellor added that he wished Dr. Strand welr and

stated that Dr. Strand had a warm group of supporters.

SEATING OF SENATORS

Senate moved that Dr. R. Rogow and Dr. G.

after being informed by the Chairman that R. R

Senate by Joint Faculty to replace temporarily

serving as Acting Academic Vice-President, and

elected by the Faculty of Education to replace

from September 1, 1969 to August

31,

1970.

APPROVAL OF AGENDA

Kirchner be seated on Senate

gow had been elected to

L. N. Srivastava while he is

that C. Kirchner had been

temporarily B. R. D'Aoust

Senator Carlson asked that Item 3(i) dealing with Paper S.258 be ruled

out

order on the basis that Senate had already

motion dealing with the offering of PSA 474. The

out of order because notice of motion had been sul

Senatewell in advance of the Senate meeting, and

be considered.

taken action on a previous

Chairman ruled this request

mitted to the Secretary of

therefore this matter could

M. Caiñpbell requested that two items

with in the Closed Session under Business

Chairman ruled that the items referred to

1Ioved by Mrs. L. Freiman, seconded b

"that the Agenda as recommended

Committee be approved."

be added to the agenda and be dealt

Arising from the Minutes. The

could be taken up later.

L. Srivastava,

by the Senate Agenda

MOTiON CARRIED

3. APPROVAL OF MINUTES OF OPEN SESSION OF AUGUST 4, 1969

Ii.. Srivastava noted that lines 2 and 3 of Item 3 appearing on Page 3

should read 'he and the Deans" rather than 'he and the Acting President."

N. Campbell asked if the Board had received Senate Paper S.251, dealing

with 4ualifications for a Dean of Graduate Studies. It was pointed out that

the paper had been received by the Board and approved.

H. Lebowitz noted that the minutes of August 4, with regard to receipt

of Paper S.215 from the Faculty of Arts, did not reflect exactly what had

transpired. It was agreed that he would submit

1:0

the Secretary a revised

statement for inclusion in the minutes. N. Lebowitz also noted that in

Appendix A, Political Science, Sociology, and Anthropology should be shown

as onedepartment rather than three as implied in the circulated listing.

AA-

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S.M. 8/9/69

A McDougall stated that on Page 9, Paragraph

should read that

R. Carlson. moved that PSA 474 be

rerred back to the Faculty of Arts

Curriculum Committee and that as there was no seconder the motion failed.

A. McDougall stated also that on Page 9, Paragraph 3 it should read

that bean Sullivan would bring to Senate "within the next two meetings" a

paper on criteria for documentation on curriculum changes.

As there were no further amendments the minutes were approved as

amended.

4. BUSINESS ARISING FROM THE MINUTES

Paper_S.258

I'SA 474

R. Carlson asked that. this Item be ruled out of order on the basis

that he Senate cannt rescind an action already taken as a result of a

motion made at the previous meeting to take that action. In this case

Senate had voted to refer the matter back to the Faculty of Arts

Curriculum Committee, an action which Senate now cannot undo.

b. Sullivan s:ated that he had come to the meeting prepared to give a

ort on the action recommended by the Faculty of Arts Curriculuni Committee

on PSA 474

The Chairman stated that Senate could undo what it had voted to do at

the previous meeting if it so wished, lie ruled that Senate could undo the

referral back to the Faculty of Arts Curriculum Committee, and that a motion

to rescind would not he out of order.

On a motion by D. Sullivan, seconded by K. Burstein the ruling of the

Chair was challenged with a vote of 12 in favour and 13 opposed to sustaining

the Chair.

D. Sullivan then reported on the deliberations of the Faculty of Arts

Curri q

uluin Committee which both R. Carlson and Professor Hickersoi, who was

to tech PSA 474, attended. The Curriculum Committee recommended that PSA

474 be offered in the 69-3 semester.

It was moved by D. Sullivan, seconded by J. Waikley, "that the report

from the Faculty of Arts Curriculum Committee be received," but after

reference to the Rules it was pointed out that the Senate had received the

report by hearing it. This was accepted by the Chairman and he so ruled.

Mpved by A. McDougall, seconded by I). Sullivan

"that Senate accept PSA 474 as a new course as outlined

in Senate Paper

S.253,

Page III."

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S.M. 8/9/69

R. Carlson stated that he would serve notice of motion with regard

to restricting enrolment in the course to include only students who have

taken Archaeology 272,

if Senate passed the motion on the floor. He

added that at an earlier Senate meeting Senate had voted to separate

Archaeology Studies from PSA and he could not see the logic or justice cf

giving back part of Archaeology to PSA by approving a PSA course which

overlaps with a course in Archaeology.

Considerable discussion followed on the difference between R. Carison's

statement on course overlap and the recommendation by the Faculty of Arts

Curriculum Committee that the course should be accepted. Reference was made

to A. McDougall's rebuttal of R. Carlson's claim of course overlap as

presented on Paper S.258.

loved by Mrs. L Freiman, seconded by K. Burstein,

that the previous question be put."

NOTION ON PREVIOUS QUESTION

CARRIED

21 in favour

8 opposed

uestion was called on the main motion that Senate accept PSA 474 as

a new course, and a vote was taken.

MAIN MOTION CARRIED

21 in favour

opposed

It was moved by R. Carlson, seconded by R. Brown, "that only students

who have taken and passed Archaeology 272 be permitted to resister for PSA

474." The Chairman ruled the motion out of order on the basis that a notice

of motion presented from the floor, as this one was, could not be considered

at the meeting in which notice of motion is given. The ruling of the Chair

was c1al1enged and a vote taken to sustain the ruling. The ruling was sus-

tained, with 16 in favour and8 opposed.

Moved by A. McDougall, seconded by J. Sayre,

that Senate suspand its rule, in the case of PSA 474,

arising out of a motion passed at the September, 1967

Senate Meeting (Page 8 of minutes of that meeting)

1:0

the effect that no new course may be scheduled for a

given semester unless it has been approved by Senate at

least one month before the beginning of that semester."

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Debate followed on whether or not this motion would be considered

after the motion is passed that "Senate instruct the Registrar to schedule

and accept the registrations in PSA 474 for the 69-3 semester." It was

ruled by the Chairman that suspension of the rule would be considered first.

The Registrar indicated that no students had been formally registered

in PSA 474 for this semester and the course did not appear in the time table

but that the Department had carried out a preregistration on the understand-

ing that registration could take place only after the Senate meeting on

September 8, 1969, if Senate passed PSA 474 at that meeting. He stated also

that students registering for this course were asked to indicate alternative

cours.s in registration in case PSA 474 was not to be offered.

Question was called on the motion to suspend the rules in the case of

PSA 474 and a vote was taken.

MOTION CARRIED

14 in favour

12 opposed

Moved by A. McDougall, seconded by D. Korbin,

that Senate instruct the Registrar to schedule and accept

the registrations in PSA 474 for the 69-3 semester."

Debate centered on whether or not the course was needed immediately

for graduation, how many students required it, and if there was someone

qualified to teach it.

Moved by K. Burstein, seconded by G. Kirchner,

"that the previous question be put.'

MOTION ON PREVIOUS QUESTION

CARRIED

20 in favour

6 opposed

Question was called on the main motion to schedule and accept PSA

474 for the 69-3 semester and a vote taken.

MAIN MOTION CARRIED

19 in favour

9 opposed

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S.M. 8/9/69

It was moved by N. Lehowitz, seconded by A. McDougall, "that Senate

apologize to the students and staff of PSA for any inconvenience resulting

from previous action taken at the Senate meeting of August 4, 1969," but

the Chairman ruled the motion out of order.

REPORT OF CHAIP\NA

The Chairman had no report to make other than to draw Senate's

attention to the address he had made earlier in the day (attached as

Appendix A). Many of the points made in the address will be brought before

Senate in the future.

REPORTS OF COii'IITTEES -

Par 1

S.259 - Senate Committee on Graduate Studies

Moved by

Srivastava, seconded by R. Cole,

that Senate agree that for a student to receive a

graduate degree from the University he must have a

cumulative grade point average of 3.0 or higher over

all courses taken for the degree."

considerable discussion followed on whether or not courses had to be

taken at Simon Fraser University, if the intent was to mean all courses

taken or all courses required, and how cumulative grade point average was

determined.

Amendment was moved by U. Sullivan, seconded by Mrs. L. Freiman,

"that the word 'required' be substituted for the

word 'taken. '"

A further amendment was moved by K. Burstein that the wards "at SFU"

be added after the word "degree." The Chairman ruled that this amendment

to the amendment was out of order.

Moved by N. Lebowitz, seconded by J. Hutchinson,

"that this Item be referred back to the Senate Committee

on Graduate Studies asking the Committee to report back

on merits of the original proposal and the amendment."

Several requests were made to have the entire paper sent back to the

Committee rather than just Item 1.

Amendment to the motion for referral was moved by K. Burstein, seconded

by J. Walkley,

"that the motion of referral be amended to read' 'that the

entire document, Paper S.259, be referred back to the

Senate Committee on Graduate Studies for reconsideration.'"

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S.M. 8/9/69

AMENDMENT TO REFER CARRIED

21 in favour

opposed

Question was then called on the amended motion to refer and a vote

taken

AMENDED MOTION TO REFER CARRIED

None opposed

It was then moved by J. Sayre that this Paper be returned to Senate

by the November meeting of Senate.

REPORTS OF FACULTIES

No reports.

OTHER 'BUSINESS

A) Notices of Motion

1) Pa

p er S.255, Revised

_-_Ellis Report, Retroactivit v.

Moved by ii. Campbell, seconded by

Kenward,

"that Basic Assumption No. 1 of Paper 5.255 be accepted,

that no motions are necessary concerning retroactive

application of admissions criteria since students who

have been denied admission in the past can re-apply."

MOTION CARRIED

None opposed

Moved by N. Campbell, seconded by J. Kenward,

"that Basic Assumption No. 2 of Paper S.255 be accepted,

that by January 1970 the Academic Board or the Academic

Vice-President should have ready a list of courses

offered by junior and regional colleges in British Columbia

together with general elective credit, unassigned credit in

a subject area or SFU equivalent credit that will be allowed

for these courses. The amount (and nature) of general

elective credit which each faculty-will credit towards its

degree will be included in this list."

(.t

S.M. 8/9/69

Questions were raised with regard to the lists which are being

compiled, and to be compiled, with enquiry as to how they are

compiled, by whom and where they are at present.

On the request of K. Burstein a paper prepared by C. Crawford

of the Department of Psychology was distributed by the Secretariat

involving a complaint on the procedures used by the Implementation

Committee (paper attached as Appendix

A to Paper S.257a). Lengthy

discussion with argument followed. L. Srivastava, Chairman of the

Implementation Committee, D. Meakin and H. Evans responded and

explained that lists of courses have been compiled through the

Implementation Committee covering the majority of courses currently

offered in B.C. regional colleges, that discussions or communications

have been held with the heads or delegated persons within the various

university departments, that the lists reflect courses for which

course equivalent credit has been indicated, that they reflect cases

of subject- area but non-equivalent course credits and that they show

areas where only general elective transfer credit could be considered.

It was noted that decision on the utilization of courses in the general

elective transfer credit area for credit towards degrees within any

given faculty still required decision by the individual faculties,

that the lists had not yet been distributed to faculties for these

indications, and that this information would be expected before the

lists are printed. It was pointed out that some courses still

required review and decision, particularly where new calendars or

other changes were being made within a college.

The Chairman indicated that it was his understanding that if the

lists were not prepared by January 1970,.the process suggested in

the motion would not go into effect and H. Campbell accepted this

interpretation.

H. Evans pointed out that it would not be possible to generate lists

for all institutions of the province by January 1970 and that it was

understood that Paper S.255 and its basic assumptions pertain at

this time only to the regional colleges of the province, and H.

Campbell concurred that this was the intent.

With this understanding, Basic Assumption No. 3 was briefly discussed

and accepted without opposition.

Discussion continued on Basic Assumption No. 4 and questions arose

with regard to retroactivity and appeals. K. Burstein stated that

Item 4 was out of order because it had nothing to do with retroactivity

and that it dealt with appeals only M. Campbell offered to reword

Item 4 to read: "Students who are admitted under the provisions of

the Ellis Report requesting transfer credit will not be allowed to

apply for credit following these procedures but will have to direct

any or all appeals to the Senate Appeals Committee." The Secretary

r2''

'cpt

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S.M. 8/9/69

noted that the procedure suggested could require major activity

on the part of the Appeals Committee and the students but that by

appropriate wording of statements, as the Lnplementation Committee

implements sections of the Ellis Report, much of this difficulty

could be overcome, provided the mover agreed, and M. Campbell

concurred with this approach.

Discussion continued and after hearing additional arguments .foi

deleting Item 4, with the concurrence of the mover Item 4 was

deleted.

Discussion then centered on Item 5 of Paper

S.255

Revised.

Amendment was moved by K. Burstein, seconded by R. Cole,

"that the last sentence of Item 5, Paper S.255 Revised,

be deleted."

Question was called on the amendment to delete the last sentence

of Item 5 and a vote taken.

AMENDMENT CARRIED

15 in favour

opposed

Moved by M. Campbell, seconded by L.

Srivastava,

"that Senate adopt Basic Assumptions as stated in Items

1, 2, 3 and 5 as amended of Paper

S.255,

Revised."

After further discussion, it was

Moved by J. Kenward, seconded by'K. Burstein,

"that Paper S.255, Revised be referred back to M. Campbell's

committee for further thought and consideration."

Amendment to the referred motion was made by

Lebowitz,

seconded by J. Sayre, "that the motion be amended by adding

'and that K. Burstein be requested to write out his comments

on Paper S.255, Revised, and revisions proposed,'" but it was

doubted if Senate could rightfully demand a Senator to do this,

and the amendment was dropped.

Discussion followed on the advisability of referral with emphasis

placed on the careful and detailed working out in the implementa-

tion of retroactivity by the Registrar's office and the Im

lementa-

tion Committee.

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S.N. 8/9/69

Question was called on the motion to refer and a vote was

taken-

MOTION TO REFER CARRIED

15 in favour

4 opposed

ii) Papers

S.257, S.257a -

I m p 1ementat

onof Ellis Report

Moved by L. Srivastava, seconded by R. Brown,

"that the requirements of Sections 2.3 and 3.4

of the Ellis Report be changed from an average

of 2.0 (60%) to an average of 2.4 (65%)."

It was explained by L. Srivastava that the Report con--

tained in Paper

S.257 had been prepared on August 4

showing what had been done to that time with regard to

implementing the Ellis Report, and that little had been

added since. He added that only about four or five

courses had not been accepted by the departments to date

and that one major point needed to be cleared by Senate.

This point referred to the motion submitted and if passed

would clear up the discrepnnc between admission require-

ments for those seeking transfer credit from institutions

outside the province, particularly from the United States.

Burstein voiced concern over some of the procedures

followed by the Implementation Committee in that his

department's objections to course equivalents had been

ignored by the Committee and he referred to complaints

about this matter submitted in the paper by Dr. Crawford.

Srivastava reported that departments do have the

privilege of helping to determine course equivalents

and

that if there is

any

department which does not accept the

courses listed for its department these matters will be

brought before Senate to resolve. L. Srivastava added also

that course equivalent lists will not be published until

they have been sent to all departments and to Senate.

N. Lebowitz stated that he was concerned about the program

for mature students and said that he hoped it will be made

known how mature students have done at Simon Fraser before

much is done about changing admission procedures for them.

L. Srivastava stated that the Implementation Committee would

provide information on this point when the Committee gets it.

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S.M. 8/9/69

Qestion was raised by K. Burstein pertaining to general

elective credit and the recording of credit on transcripts.

The Registrar noted that under the terms of the Ellis

Report all transfer credit was to he designated under three

headings which involve Simon Fraser course equivalents,

unassigned credit in a subject area and unassigned credit

with later change to the utilization of the term "general

elective credit' to replace "unassigned credit," and that

one of the basic principles was that where a course is

accepted as being a university level course, that the

student on transfer would receive the same amount of credit

as he would have received for such course taken at the

institution. It was further noted that there had been

considerable debate as to the nature of how general elective

credit would operate, with discussion on a number of occasions

at Senate and also by the Implementation Committee.

In keeping with the Report, permits to register did carry

notations as to the type of transfer credit applicable to

any course, but the missing area at the present time in terms

of general elective credit is the value of the particular

course towards a degree in either Arts or Education or

Science as this is still, to be determined and reported upon

by the individual faculties.

K. Burstein asked that J. Sayre's motion with regard to un-

assigned credit and general elective credit be read and

stated that there was obviously some discrepancy between

that motion and what was being done in the Registrar's Office.

The Chairman asked K. Burstein to write out his allegations

and send them to him and he will look into the allegations

himself.

Question was called on the motion to change Sections 2.3 and

3.4 of the Ellis Report and a vote was taken.

NOTION CARRIED

24 in favour

1 opposed

iii) fILer 5.260-Procedures and Responsibilities to Senate of

Senate Committees.

Moved by L. Srivastava, seconded by D. Sullivan,

"that Paper S.260 be dealt with in the Closed

Session."

C (

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S.N. 81/9/69

It was felt that this item should be handled in Cioed

Session if any personal names were to be brought out in

discussion. N. Lebowitz said that no names need be

brought out and that the Paper could readily be dealt

with in Open Session.

Question was called on the motion and a vote taken.

MOTION CARRIED

10 in favour

6 c?pposed

Senators L. Freiman and M. Lebowitz asked that their

negative votes be recorded.

iv) Paper S.261 - Recorrnrtendation to the Board of Governors

N. Lebowitz reported that he had intended to make a motion,

but had decided to withdraw the motion at this time because

he did not have the documents he had hoped to have to

support the motion.

As there was no objection the motion was withdrawn,

perS.2G2_-_Production

Schedule -Graduate and Und

ergr a

ate

Calendars 1970-71

It was indicated that Item 1 would be considered ad seriatim.

Moved by J. Kenward, seconded by N. Campbell,

"that Motion (1) of Paper S.262 be adopted to the

effect that November 3, 1969 be the last date for

submission by Departments to the Registrar of all

copy materials for both the Undergraduate and the

Graduate Calendars for 1970-71."

Discussion centered on several points. It was pointed out

that 60 days is insufficient time for departments and

faculties to make the necessary changes, that decisions

relating to calendar changes are basically educational and

philosophical rather than technical, and that improvements

in production will have to be worked out by the Registrar's

Office to accommodate the needs of departments and

faculties.

The Secretary explained that under present conditions a tight

schedule had to be kept to publish a calendar which would be

out in ample time for use in B.C. secondary schools. Other-

wise the result would be similar to this past year where the

Calendar was published at such a late date it was useless for

counselors and students in the secondary schools.

:;14,.- ("

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S.M. 8/9/69

Amendment was moved by Mrs. L. Freiman, seconded by

D. Tuck,

"that the last date for submission by Departments to

the Registrar of all copy of materials for both the

Undergraduate and the Graduate Calendars for 1970-71

be extended one month from November 3, 1969 to

December 3, 1969."

MOTION CARRIED

On Notion (2) of Paper S.262 which reads,

"that December 8, 1969 be established as the date for

the Special Meeting of Senate to approve calendar

items for 1970-71,"

it was moved by D. Sullivan, seconded by A. MacKinnon,

"that this item be referred back to the Registrar's

Office for further consideration."

MOTION TO REFER CARRIED

It was questioned why Senate needed a Special Meeting to

approve calendar items at that time. It was suggested that

Senate meet further on in the process when the material

is closer to final form. it was recommended also that con-

sideration be given to forming a Calendar Committee to

handle calendar publications.

On Motion (3) of Paper S.262 which reads,

"That other than in the most exceptional circumstances,

for which Senate would suspend its normal rules, the

offering of courses in a given semester would be

restricted to those courses already approved by Senate

appearing within the calendar for the semester concerned,"

it was moved by H. Lebowitz, seconded by D. Sullivan,

"that th..s item be referred back to the Registrar's

Office for further consideration."

The view was expressed that a small bulletin could be printed

each, semester listing courses offered that semester. It was

pointed out that the University needs to move rapidly towards

indicating to prospective students exactly what courses will

be offered several semesters in advance.

S.M. 8/9/69

Question On referral was called and a vote taken

MOTION TO REFER CARRIED

14 in favour

4 opposed

Other Items

M. Lebowitz gave notice of motion that he would move in Closed

Session that proceedings from Paper S.260 be published in the

minutes of the Open Session.

Date of Next Meeting

The Chairman announced that the next Senate meeting would be on.

Monday, October 6, 1969 at 7:30 p.m.

Confidential Matters

Open Session adjourned at 1:05 a.m. to move into Closed Session.

H. M. Evans

Secretary